Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee Relating to the Report
Appendix 1
Appendix 1
Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee Relating to the Report
COMMITTEE FOR FINANCE
WEDNESDAY, 8 SEPTEMBER 2021
Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings, Belfast
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video-conference:
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Maoliosa McHugh MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Angela McParland (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Mr Raymond McCaffrey (Research Officer) – item 6 only
The meeting commenced in open session at 2:00pm.
1. Apologies
There were no apologies.
Mr Pat Catney indicated he would be leaving the meeting early and would delegate authority to vote on his behalf to Mr Mathew O’Toole under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
2. Declaration of Interests
Mr Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as the Assembly Party Group Chairperson of the All Party Group on Press Freedom and Media Sustainability
There were no other declarations of interest.
6. Research and Information Service (RaISe) Presentation: Defamation Bill
The Research Officer joined the meeting at 2.15pm.
- Raymond McCaffrey, Research Officer, RaISe.
The Committee noted a research paper.
The Chairperson thanked the Research Officer for his presentation.
7. Mr Mike Nesbitt MLA: Defamation Bill
The Sponsor of the Private Members Bill: Defamation Bill joined the meeting at 2.51pm.
- Mr Mike Nesbitt MLA.
The Committee noted the report by Dr (now Professor) Andrew Scott ‘Reform of Defamation Law in Northern Ireland’.
Mr Pat Catney left the meeting at 3:19pm and delegated authority to vote on his behalf to Mr Matthew O’Toole under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
The Chairperson thanked Mr Nesbitt for his briefing.
The Committee noted that in the event of the Bill moving to Committee Stage, Standing Orders were unlikely to be revised in time in order to allow the Sponsor’s participation as an “ex-officio” Member of the Finance Committee.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Minister in order to seek his views on the Defamation Bill.
Members expressed differing views on the Defamation Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that the Chairperson could speak at the Second Stage debate on behalf of the Committee in order to acknowledge this and to recognise that the Committee had received an overview briefing of the Bill from its Sponsor.
The meeting was adjourned at 4.16pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
8 September 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
3 November 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Apologies:
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:02pm in closed session.
The Deputy Chairperson chaired proceedings.
Proceedings continued in open session from 2:12pm
3. Apologies
Apologies were as indicated above.
Maolíosa McHugh delegated authority to vote on his behalf to Philip McGuigan under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
Jemma Dolan delegated authority to vote on her behalf to Philip McGuigan under Temporary Standing Order 115(6), in the event of an early departure.
Declaration of Interests
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as he is the chairperson of the All Party Group on Press Freedom and Media Sustainability.
Steve Aiken joined the meeting and chaired proceedings from 2:14pm.
Matthew O’Toole left the meeting at 3:17pm and delegated authority to vote on his behalf to Pat Catney under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
9. Oral Evidence – Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill – Dr Andrew Scott
The witness joined the meeting at 3:38pm.
- Dr Andrew Scott, London School of Economics.
The Committee noted papers relating to the Bill.
The evidence session was recorded by Hansard.
Jemma Dolan left the meeting at 3:50pm.
Jim Wells left the meeting at 3:57pm
The Chairperson thanked the witness for his evidence.
Agreed:The Committee agreed to write to Dr Scott asking him to detail his amendments in writing in respect of the use of a jurisdictional bar to prosecution where prompt corrections are issued and in respect of how legislation might dissuade strategic law suits against public participation (so-called SLAPPs).
Agreed:The Committee agreed to publish all responses to the call for evidence as they are received and to extend the call for evidence for a few weeks.
The meeting was adjourned at 4:38pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
10 November 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
10 November 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Apologies:
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:01pm in public session.
1. Apologies
Apologies were as indicated above.
Maolíosa McHugh delegated authority to vote on his behalf to Philip McGuigan under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
10. Oral Evidence – Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Department of Finance
Departmental officials joined the meeting at 3:44pm.
Michael Foster, Head of Civil Law Reform Division, Department of Finance.
Martin Tyrell, Principal Legal Officer, Civil Law Reform Division, Department of Finance.
The Committee noted Departmental papers and an extract from the Gillen Review of Civil Justice 2017.
The oral evidence session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the officials for their evidence.
Jim Allister left the meeting at 4:37pm.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Department suggesting that it puts down amendments to the Bill in order to correct what it believes to be errors and seeking its views in respect of: discretionary powers for judges; mandatory mediation; higher thresholds for public corporations; and summaries of scientific reports in other journals.
The meeting was adjourned at 4:56pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
17 November 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
24 November 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:00pm in public session.
Jim Allister left the meeting at 4:08pm.
7. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence
The witness joined the meeting at 4:09pm.
- Dr Mark Hanna, School of Law, Queen’s University Belfast.
The witness briefed Members on his response to the call for evidence on the Defamation Bill.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the witness for his evidence.
Maolíosa McHugh left the meeting at 4:44pm.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Department of Finance and the Bill Sponsor seeking their views on the questions raised by respondents to the call for evidence.
Agreed: The Committee noted a Departmental response on the Bill and agreed to write to the shadow Civil Justice Council to seek its views on matters relating to the discretionary power of judges including in respect of the use of Alternative Dispute Resolution.
The meeting was adjourned at 5:00pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
1 December 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
1 December 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Apologies:
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:00pm in public session.
1. Apologies
Apologies were as indicated above.
Philip McGuigan delegated authority to vote on his behalf to Maolíosa McHugh under Temporary Standing Order 115(6).
6. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence
The witness joined the meeting at 2:04pm.
- Paul Tweed, Lawyer.
The Committee noted Mr Tweed’s submission to the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
Mr Tweed briefed the Committee.
Matthew O’Toole joined the meeting at 2:15pm.
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as Chairperson of the All Party Group on Press Freedom and Media Sustainability.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the witness for his briefing.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to Mr Tweed seeking his views on the Westminster On-line Safety Bill and the merits of a Communications and Decency Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and the Minister for the Economy seeking clarity on the Westminster On-line Safety Bill and its applicability to Northern Ireland and overlap with the Defamation Bill.
Proceedings were suspended at 3:20pm
Proceedings resumed at 3:23pm with Steve Aiken; Keith Buchanan; Jim Allister; Jemma Dolan; Maolíosa McHugh; and Jim Wells in the meeting.
7. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence
The witnesses joined the meeting at 3:23pm.
- Mr Sam McBride, author and journalist.
- Mr David Attfield, a Legal Director, BBC.
The Committee noted Mr McBride’s and the BBC submission to the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
The witnesses briefed the Committee.
Pat Catney rejoined the meeting at 3:25pm.
Matthew O’Toole rejoined the meeting at 3:26pm.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the witnesses for their evidence
10. Forward Work Programme
Agreed: The Committee agreed to schedule a briefing from the National Union of Journalists for 8 December 2021 on the Defamation Bill.
The meeting was adjourned at 5:15pm
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
8 December 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
8 December 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:03pm in public session.
Matthew O’Toole joined the meeting at 2:03pm.
6. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence from National Union of Journalists (NUJ)
The witness joined the meeting at 2:03pm.
- Professor Chris Frost, National Union of Journalists.
The Committee noted the National Union of Journalists’ submission to the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as Chairperson of the All Party Group on Press Freedom and Media Sustainability.
Professor Frost briefed the Committee.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The evidence session was reported by Hansard.
Jemma Dolan joined the meeting at 2:15pm.
Jim Allister left the meeting at 2:36pm.
The Chairperson thanked the witness for his briefing.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the National Union of Journalists (NUJ) seeking clarification on: the level of Independent Press Standards Organisation membership for Northern Ireland media organisations; changes (if any) to the insurance premiums for media organisations since the passage of the Defamation Act 2013; and the level of the Northern Ireland membership of NUJ and the number of complaints and sanctions for its Northern Ireland membership in respect of the NUJ code.
7. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence from Index on Censorship and English PEN
The witnesses joined the meeting at 2:54pm.
- Ms Jessica Ní Mhainín, Policy and Campaigns Manager, Index on Censorship.
- Mr Charlie Holt, UK Campaigns Advisor, English PEN.
The Committee noted a joint submission from the Index on Censorship and English PEN (Poets, Essayists and Novelists) to the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
The witnesses briefed the Committee.
Jim Wells joined the meeting at 3:11pm.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
Jim Allister rejoined the meeting at 3:33pm.
Matthew O’Toole left the meeting at 3:36pm.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the witnesses for their evidence.
8. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Oral Evidence
The witness joined the meeting at 3:44pm.
- Mr Peter Girvan, Barrister.
The Committee noted Mr Girvan’s submission to the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
The witness briefed the Committee.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the witnesses for their evidence.
The meeting was adjourned at 5:00pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
15 December 2021
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
15 December 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Ms Marion Johnston (Clerical Officer)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Proceedings commenced at 2:02pm in public session.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to adopt a revised agenda.
Maoliosa McHugh joined the meeting at 2:03pm.
6. Matters Arising
The Clerk provided advice to the Committee in respect of defamation and absolute privilege.
Some Members indicated in no uncertain terms the critical importance of absolute privilege in exercising their mandate and in terms of scrutinising public interest matters. Those Members indicated that they would not accept any contrived limit on the use of absolute privilege in support of scrutiny.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content for the Chairperson to raise related issues at the Chairperson’s Liaison Group.
7. Oral Evidence: Defamation Bill – Committee Stage
The officials joined the meeting at 3:59pm.
- Michael Foster, Head of Civil Law Reform Division, Department of Finance.
- Martin Tyrell, Principal Legal Officer, Civil Law Reform, Department of Finance.
The officials briefed the Committee.
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as Chairperson of the All Party Group on Media Sustainability and Press Freedom.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the officials for their evidence.
The meeting was adjourned at 5:24
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
5 January 2022
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
5 January 2021
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Ms Barbara Love (Bill Clerk) – agenda item 1 only
Proceedings commenced at 2:00pm in closed session.
1. Defamation Bill – Procedural Advice
The Committee noted procedural advice provided by the Bill Clerk in respect of the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to give further consideration to the admissibility criteria for amendments to Bills.
Proceedings continued in open session from 2:11pm.
3 Declaration of Interests
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as the Chairperson of the All Party Group on press freedom and media sustainability.
There were no other declarations of interest.
7. Oral Evidence: Defamation Bill – Committee Stage
The Committee noted papers from the Bill Sponsor, the National Union of Journalists and the shadow Civil Justice Council.
The Bill Sponsor joined the meeting at 2:12pm.
- Mike Nesbitt MLA.
The Bill Sponsor briefed the Committee.
This was followed by a question and answer session.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Chairperson thanked the Bill Sponsor for his evidence.
Members recorded their abhorrence in respect of the appalling abuse that an elected representative had received recently on social media.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that the Chairperson should write to the Minister in respect of Departmental commentary which had suggested that the Bill Sponsor had been inactive in respect of the development of provisions within the Defamation Bill and asking if these remarks will be withdrawn.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Bill Sponsor seeking his commentary on possible amendments to the Bill including: a review clause; judicial discretion in respect of jury trials; and changes to the jurisdiction of the county court.
15. Correspondence
15.15 The Committee considered correspondence from Paul Tweed on the Defamation Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to Mr Tweed and confirm that he is content for his submission to be published in the Committee’s report.
The meeting was adjourned at 4:03pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
12 January 2022
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
12 January 2022
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Ms Barbara Love (Bill Clerk) (for items 6 & 7 only)
Proceedings commenced at 2:00pm in public session.
The meeting continued in closed session at 2:17pm.
6. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage - Committee Deliberations
The Committee noted papers from the Bill Sponsor and the Examiner of Statutory Rules.
The Committee deliberated informally on the Bill.
The meeting continued in public session at 3:13pm.
7. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage - Informal Clause by Clause Scrutiny
The Committee commenced its informal clause by clause consideration of the Defamation Bill.
Clause 1 – Serious Harm
Members expressed differing views on this clause.
The Committee informally agreed that it would not progress any of the suggested amendments in respect of: access for ordinary people; trivial claims; protections for NGOs; a higher bar for for-profit companies; and inference of serious harm and that it would give further consideration to the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 2 – Truth
The Committee informally agreed that it would not progress the suggested amendment in respect of pre-trial hearings and that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 3 – Honest Opinion
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the suggested Bill Sponsor amendment in respect of clarifying reasonable belief and that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 4 – Publication on a Matter of Public Interest
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 5 – Operators of Websites
The Committee noted the possibility of conflict between Clause 5 and anticipated Westminster legislation on On-Line Safety and also noted the possibility of conflict between the regulation-making power in sub-clause 5(5) and Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights.
The Committee informally agreed that it would not progress the suggested amendment in respect of a level playing-field for different media operators and that it would give further consideration to the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 6 – Peer-Reviewed Statement in Scientific or Academic Journal etc.
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 7 – Reports etc. Protected by Privilege
Jim Allister recorded reservations in respect of sub-clause 7(5) which would amend the Defamation Act 1996 in order to apply certain provisions in respect of the fair and accurate reporting in a matter of public interest in a news conference.
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 8 – Single Publication Rule
The Committee informally agreed that it would give further consideration to the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 9 – Action against a person not domiciled in the UK or a Member State
The Committee noted the Bill Sponsor’s amendment in respect of the incorrect reference to the UK as a member state of the EU. Jim Allister indicated his opposition to the clause. Nonetheless the Committee informally agreed it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 10 – Action Against a Person who was not the author, editor, etc.
Some Members indicated informal support for the clause and the amendment proposed by the Bill Sponsor in respect of enhancing the definition of author etc.. The Committee informally agreed to give further consideration to the suggested amendment and to the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 11 – Trial to be without a jury
The Committee felt that the clause as drafted would allow the judge discretion to retain the option of trial by jury. However, some Members indicated concern that the clause would serve to undermine access to jury trials. The Committee informally agreed to give further consideration to the suggested Bill Sponsor amendment relating to the use of Alternative Dispute Resolution and to the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 12 – Power of court to order a summary of its judgement to be published
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 13 – Order to remove statement or cease distribution etc.
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 14 – Actions for slander: special damage
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 15 – Meaning of “publish” and “statement”
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 16 – Consequential amendments and savings etc.
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 17 – Regulations and orders
The Committee noted the report of the Examiner of Statutory Rules on the regulating-making powers in the Bill. The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Clause 18 – Commencement
The Committee noted that some of the provisions of the Bill are commenced at the discretion of the Department, albeit with the agreement of the Assembly. The Committee informally agreed that it support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill, as appropriately amended.
Clause 19 – Short Title
The Committee informally agreed that it would support the proposition that the clause stands part of the Bill.
Other Amendments
The Committee informally agreed that it would not support amendments relating to the single meaning rule or the use of discursive remedies
Jim Allister indicated concern in respect of the principle of approving a defective Bill and seeking to repair it with a review provision. Nonetheless, the Committee informally agreed that it would support an amendment in respect of a review clause.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Bill Sponsor: seeking urgent sight of his proposed amendments; in relation to commencement issues and the potential for a sub-clause 5(5) clash with Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights; and setting out the Committee’s informal position on other clauses and amendments.
The Chairperson recorded the Committee’s thanks to the Clerk; the Examiner of Statutory Rules; and the Committee Staff Team for their work on this Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to undertake formal clause by clause scrutiny of the Defamation Bill at its meeting of 19 January 2022.
The meeting was adjourned at 3:42pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
5 January 2022
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
19 January 2022
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Philip McGuigan MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Apologies:
None
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
In Attendance by Video or Teleconference:
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
Ms Barbara Love (Bill Clerk) (Item 6 only)
The meeting commenced at 2:00pm in open session
6. Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Formal Clause by Clause Scrutiny
The Bill Sponsor joined the meeting at 2:03pm.
- Mike Nesbitt MLA
The Committee noted the Bill Sponsor’s tabled amendments.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Committee commenced its formal clause by clause consideration of the Defamation Bill.
Clause 1 - Serious Harm
The Committee considered Clause 1 as drafted.
The question was put that the Committee was content that Clause 1 as drafted should stand as part of the bill.
The Committee divided: Ayes 4; Noes 5; Abstain 0.
AYES NOES
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister
Mr Pat Catney Mr Keith Buchanan
Mr Matthew O’Toole Ms Jemma Dolan
Mr Jim Wells Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Maolíosa McHugh
The motion was negatived.
Clause 2 - Truth
The Committee considered Clause 2 and a proposed amendment which included a typographical correction:
Amendment 1
Clause 2, Page 1, Line 19 –
Leave out ‘Defamation (Northern Ireland) Act’ and insert ‘Defamation Act (Northern Ireland)’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that to amend Clause 2 as indicated in Amendment 1.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 2 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 3 - Honest Opinion
The Committee considered Clause 3 and proposed Amendments 2, 3 and 4.
Amendment 2
Clause 3, Page 2, Line 12 -
After ‘before’ insert ‘or at the same time as’
Amendment 4
Clause 3, Page 2, Line 31
Leave out ‘Defamation (Northern Ireland) Act’ and insert ‘Defamation Act (Northern Ireland)’
Agreed:The Committee agreed to it was content to amend Clause 3 as indicated in Amendment 2 and Amendment 4.
Amendment 3
Clause 3, Page 2, Line 13, -
at end insert- ‘(c) any fact that the defendant reasonably believed to exist at the time the statement complained of was published.’
The question was put that the Committee was content to amend Clause 3 as amended as indicated in Amendment 3.
The Committee divided: Ayes 7; Noes 2; Abstain 0.
AYES NOES
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister
Mr Pat Catney Mr Keith Buchanan
Ms Jemma Dolan
Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Maolíosa McHugh
Mr Matthew O’Toole
Mr Jim Wells
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 3 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 4 - Public Interest
The Committee considered Clause 4.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 4 as drafted should stand as part of the Bill.
Clause 5 - Website Operators
The Committee considered Clause 5 and a proposed amendment:
Amendment 5
Clause 5, Page 4, Line 4
Leave out subsections (8), (9) and (10)
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was to amend Clause 5 as indicated in Amendment 5.
The question was put that the Committee was content that Clause 5 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
The Committee divided: Ayes 1: Noes 6: Abstain 2.
AYES NOES ABSTAIN
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister Mr Matthew O’Toole
Mr Keith Buchanan Mr Pat Catney
Ms Jemma Dolan
Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Maolíosa McHugh
Mr Jim Wells
The motion was negatived.
Clause 6 - Scientific Journals
The Committee considered Clause 6 as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that Clause 6 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 7 – Privileged Reports
The Committee considered Clause 7 as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that Clause 7 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 8 - Single Publication Rule
The Committee considered Clause 8 and a proposed amendment:
Amendment 6
Clause 8, Page 7, Line 22
Leave out ‘Act’ and insert ‘Order’
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content to amend Clause 8 as indicated in Amendment 6.
The question was put that the Committee was content that Clause 8 as amended. should stand part of the bill
The Committee divided: Ayes 3; Noes 3; Abstain 3.
AYES NOES ABSTAIN
Mr Steve Aiken Ms Jemma Dolan Mr Jim Allister
Mr Pat Catney Mr Philip McGuigan Mr Keith Buchanan
Mr Matthew O’Toole Mr Maoliosa McHugh Mr Jim Wells
The motion fell.
Clause 9 - Actions Against Those Not Domiciled in the UK etc.
The Committee considered Clause 9 and a proposed amendment:
Amendment 7
Leave out Clause 9 and insert-
Jurisdiction
‘Action against a person not domiciled in the UK
9.—(1) This section applies to an action for defamation against a person who is not domiciled in the United Kingdom.
2) A court does not have jurisdiction to hear and determine an action to which this section applies unless the court is satisfied that, of all the places in which the statement complained of has been published, Northern Ireland is clearly the most appropriate place in which to bring an action in respect of the statement.
(3) The references in subsection (2) to the statement complained of include references to any statement which conveys the same, or substantially the same, imputation as the statement complained of.
(4) Sections 41 and 42 of the Civil Jurisdiction and Judgments Act 1982 apply for the purpose of determining whether an individual, corporation or association is regarded as “domiciled in the United Kingdom” for the purposes of this section.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to amend Clause 9 as indicated in Amendment 7.
The question was put that the Committee was content that Clause 9 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
The Committee divided: Ayes 5; Noes 4; Abstain 0.
AYES NOES
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister
Mr Keith Buchanan Ms Jemma Dolan
Mr Pat Catney Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Matthew O’Toole Mr Maolíosa McHugh
Mr Jim Wells
The motion was carried.
Clause 10 - Actions Against Those Who Are Not The Author Etc.
The Committee considered Clause 10 and a tabled amendment which set out definitions of author, editor etc..
The question was put that the Committee was content to amend Clause 10 as indicated in the tabled amendment.
The Committee divided: Ayes 5; Noes 3; Abstain 1.
AYES NOES Abstain
Mr Steve Aiken Ms Jemma Dolan Mr Keith Buchanan
Mr Jim Allister Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Pat Catney Mr Maolíosa McHugh
Mr Matthew O’Toole
Mr Jim Wells
The motion was carried.
The question was put that the Committee was content that Clause 10 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
The Committee divided: Ayes 4; Noes 4; Abstain 1.
AYES NOES Abstain
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister Mr Keith Buchanan
Mr Pat Catney Ms Jemma Dolan
Mr Matthew O’Toole Mr Philip McGuigan
Jim Wells Maoliosa McHugh
The motion fell.
New Clause 10A – Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR)
The Committee considered Amendment 8 which includes a new Clause 10A which allows judicial discretion to require the use of ADR.
Amendment 8
After Clause 10 insert-
New Clause 10A
‘Alternative Dispute Resolution
10A.—A judge may order plaintiffs and defendants to engage in Alternative Dispute Resolution before commencement of a trial.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that new Clause 10A as indicated in Amendment 8 should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 11 Trial without jury
The Committee considered Clause 11 as drafted.
The question was put that that the Committee was content that Clause 11 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
The Committee divided: Ayes 3; Noes 4; Abstain 2.
AYES NOES Abstain
Mr Steve Aiken Mr Jim Allister Mr Keith Buchanan
Mr Pat Catney Ms Jemma Dolan Mr Jim Wells
Mr Matthew O’Toole Mr Philip McGuigan
Mr Maolíosa McHugh
The motion was negatived.
Clause 12 - Summary Judgement
The Committee considered Clause 12.
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that Clause 12 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 13 - Order to Remove and Cease
The Committee considered Clause 13.
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that Clause 13 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 13A - County Court Jurisdiction
The Committee considered Amendment 9 which includes a new clause 13A.
Amendment 9
After Clause 13 insert-
New Clause 13A ‘Financial limits of county courts
Increase of financial limits of civil jurisdiction of county courts
13A.— The Department of Justice must carry out a review of the financial limits of civil jurisdiction of county courts in respect of libel and slander before the end of the period of 2 years beginning with the day on which this Act receives Royal Assent.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that the new Clause 13A as indicated in Amendment 9 should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 14 - Action For Slander
The Committee considered Clause 14.
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that Clause 14 as drafted should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 14A - Review
The Committee considered Amendment 10 which includes a new clause 14A:
Amendment 10
After Clause 14 insert-
New Clause 14A‘Review of Defamation Law
Review of Defamation Law
14A.—(1) The Department must keep under review all relevant developments pertaining to law on defamation as it considers appropriate.
(2) The Department must prepare a report and recommendations on—
- a. The findings of the review under subsection (1), and
- b. The operation of this Act.
(3) The Department must lay and publish the report and recommendations under subsection (2) before the end of the period of 2 years beginning with the day on which this Act receives Royal Assent.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed it was content that the new Clause 14A as indicated in Amendment 10 should stand part of the bill.
Clause 15 - Meanings
The Committee considered Clause 15 and proposed amendments:
Amendment 11
Clause 15, Page 9, Line 21
Leave out ‘Meaning of “publish” and “statement”’ and insert ‘Interpretation’
Amendment 12
Clause 15, Page 9, Line 26,
at end insert-“the Department” means The Department of Finance. “Regulations” means regulations made by the Department.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to amend Clause 15 as indicated in Amendments 11 and 12.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 15 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 16 - Consequential Amendments
The Committee considered Clause 16 and proposed amendment:
Amendment 13
Clause 16, Page 9, Line 34
Leave out ‘Defamation (Northern Ireland) Act’ and insert ‘Defamation Act (Northern Ireland)’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to amend Clause 16 as indicated in Amendment 13.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 16 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 17 - Regulations
The Committee considered Clause 17 and proposed amendments:
Amendment 14
Clause 17, Page 10, Line 9
Leave out subsection (1) and insert- ‘(1) Subject to subsection (2), regulations under this Act may not be made unless a draft of them has been laid before and approved by a resolution of the Assembly.’
Amendment 15
Clause 17, Page 10, Line 16
Leave out subsection (4)
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to amend Clause 17 as indicated in Amendments 14 and 15.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 17 as amended should stand part of the Bill.
Clause 18 Commencement
The Committee considered Clause 18 and a proposed amendment:
Amendment 16
Clause 18, Page 10, Line 19-
at end insert- ‘(1A) Section 17 and section 19 come into operation immediately.’
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to amend Clause 18 as indicated in Amendment 16.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to recommend that the Bill Sponsor bring forward a further amendment which would require provisions to be commenced after Royal Assent and not simply at the discretion of the Department.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to defer consideration of the clause as amended.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to defer consideration of the short title and long title of the Bill until 26 January 2022 and that the Clerk should prepare a report on the Committee Stage for this date.
The meeting was adjourned at 4:47pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
26 January 2022
[Extract]
Minutes of Proceedings
26 January 2022
Meeting Location: The Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings
Present:
Dr Steve Aiken OBE MLA (Chairperson
Mr Keith Buchanan MLA (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jim Allister MLA
Mr Matthew O’Toole MLA
Mr Jim Wells MLA
Present by Video or Teleconference:
Mr Pat Catney MLA
Ms Jemma Dolan MLA
Mr Maolíosa McHugh MLA
Apologies:
Philip McGuigan MLA
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stephen Magee (Clerical Supervisor)
In Attendance by Video or Teleconference:
Ms Carla Campbell (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Ms Heather Graham (Clerical Officer)
The meeting commenced at 2:01pm in open session
2. Declaration of Interests
Matthew O’Toole declared an interest as the Chairperson of the All Party Group on Press Freedom and Media Sustainability.
6.Defamation Bill – Committee Stage – Formal Clause by Clause Scrutiny and Agreement of Report
The Committee noted the Bill Sponsor’s tabled amendments.
The session was reported by Hansard.
The Committee continued its formal clause by clause consideration of the Defamation Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to table its opposition to Clause 1 stand part of the Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to table its opposition to Clause 5 stand part of the Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content to table its opposition to Clause 11 stand part of the Bill.
Members indicated that although they had not opposed the above motions, they would likely elect to vote and speak in support of some or all of the relevant clauses.
Clause 18 Commencement
The Committee considered Clause 18 and the Bill Sponsor’s proposed amendments:
Bill Sponsor Amendments 25/01/2022
Clause 18, Page 10, Line 18
Leave out subsection 1 and insert-
‘(1) Section 5 comes into operation within 6 months of the day after the day on which this Act receives Royal Assent.’
Clause 18, Page 10, Line 19, at end insert-
‘(1A) Sections 17 and 19 come into operation on the day on which this Act receives Royal Assent.’
Clause 18, Page 10, Line 20
Leave out ‘such day or days as the Department may by order appoint’ and insert ‘the day after the day on which this Act receives Royal Assent.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 18, as amended, be further amended in line with the Bill Sponsor’s proposed amendment.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 18 as amended stand part of the Bill.
Clause 19 Short Title
The Committee considered Clause 19 as drafted including the Short Title of the Bill: Defamation Act (Northern Ireland) 2021.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that Clause 19 as drafted stand part of the Bill.
Long Title
The Committee considered the Long Title as drafted: “A Bill to amend the law of defamation.”
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Long Title, as drafted.
The Chairperson advised Members that the formal clause by clause scrutiny of the Defamation Bill had concluded.
The Committee considered a draft report on the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill.
The Committee considered the Introduction section of the report, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Introduction section of the report.
The Committee considered the Committee Approach section of the report, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Committee Approach section of the report.
The Committee considered the Consideration of the Bill section of the report, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Consideration of the Bill section of the report.
The Committee considered the Clause by Clause Scrutiny section of the report, as drafted. A typographical error was highlighted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Clause by Clause Scrutiny section of the report, as amended.
The Committee considered the List of Appendices, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content that the Appendices be included in the report.
The Committee considered the Executive Summary section of the report, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Executive Summary section of the report.
The Committee considered the Title Page, Committee Membership and Powers, and Table of Contents, as drafted.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Title Page, Committee Membership and Powers, and Table of Contents.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content for the Chairperson to approve an extract from today’s minutes, that covers the consideration and approval of the Committee report, to be included in the appendices of the report.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content for the Report on the Committee Stage of the Defamation Bill to be published as its 6th Report of this mandate.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that links to the Bill Report should be sent to the Bill Sponsor, the Minister of Finance and all organisations and individuals who provided evidence to the Committee on the Bill.
The Chairperson thanked the Clerk and his team for the production of the report.
The meeting was adjourned at 4:40pm.
Dr Steve Aiken MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Finance
2 February 2022
[Extract]
