COMMITTEE FOR EMPLOYMENT AND LEARNING MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS: THURSDAY, 6 JUNE 2002 ROOM 152, PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS

Present:
Dr Esmond Birnie MLA (Chairman)
Mr Mervyn Carrick MLA (Deputy Chairman)
Dr Ian Adamson MLA
Mr John Dallat MLA
Mr Arthur Doherty MLA
Mr David Hilditch MLA
Prof Monica McWilliams MLA
Mrs Mary Nelis MLA

In Attendance:
Dr Andrew Peoples
Mr Colin Jones
Mr Paul Stitt
Ms Eileen Regan (Northern Ireland Assembly Research)

Apologies: Mrs Joan Carson MLA

The meeting opened at 2.06pm in open session.

    1. Apologies

Apologies are detailed above.

  • Draft Minutes of 30 May 2002

    Agreed. Proposed: Mr Doherty. Seconded: Mr Carrick.

  • Matters Arising

    None.

  • Correspondence

    Members considered a paper forwarded by the Committee for Finance and Personnel, providing a general overview of needs in Northern Ireland in comparison to England. Members agreed that, whilst the paper was not particularly user-friendly, it would be useful in the Committee's scrutiny of future budgetary proposals from the Department for Employment and Learning (DEL). It did consistently demonstrate that 'needs' in Northern Ireland exceed those in England.

    2.20pm. Mr Dallat left the meeting. The meeting was inquorate; the Chairman decided to continue on an informal basis.

    2.30pm. Mrs Nelis joined the meeting. The meeting resumed.

  • Briefing from Northern Ireland Assembly Research on the Employment Bill

Members were briefed by Northern Ireland Assembly Research on DEL's Employment Bill. The briefing covered the following areas:

    • key policy and legislative developments;
    • relevant statistical data;
    • a clause-by-clause review of the proposed Bill; and
    • a comparative perspective.

Following the briefing, the following areas were debated:

    • the absence of regional figures for recipients of Statutory Maternity Pay (SMP);

2.40pm. Dr Adamson joined the meeting.

    • the exclusion of existing foster carers from the benefits contained in the Bill in relation to proposals associated with adoption;
    • whether any restrictions had been imposed on the upper age limit of the adopted child;
    • whether partners or co-habitees who adopt children were covered by the proposals and, if so, how this would be monitored;

2.50pm. Prof McWilliams joined the meeting.

Prof McWilliams stated that she may have to leave to attend another Committee meeting in order to make up a quorum.

    • the possible confusion caused by the use of the term 'he,' if proposals were designed to cover both mothers and fathers;

2.53pm. Prof McWilliams left the meeting.

    • whether the legislation covered placements in relation to the adoption process and also the adoption of children from abroad;
    • the importance of equality in the proposals for both employees and the self-employed;
    • whether the self-employed, workers on fixed-term contracts, agency workers and those on employment schemes were within the scope of the proposed legislation;
    • how the financial rights of employees would be addressed in cases of business failure;

3.00pm. Mr Dallat joined the meeting.

    • how the legislation affected seasonal workers, for example in the agricultural sector;
    • the limited grounds for appeal, based on incorrect facts, when an employee was refused a request for flexible working;
    • the potential disadvantages to rural employers where public transport may be insufficient to support flexible working patterns; and
    • the lack of detail in the legalisation on employers' obligations in respect of requests for flexible working.

Members noted that copies of all submissions to the public consultations undertaken by DEL were available in the Committee Office for members' reference.

Members agreed to call the following witnesses in relation to the Committee's consideration of the Employment Bill:

    • the Federation of Small Businesses on Thursday 13 June 2002;
    • the Northern Ireland Committee of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions on Thursday 20 June 2002;
    • DEL officials on Thursday 27 June 2002; and
    • the Equality Commission on Thursday 4 July 2002.

Action: Clerk.

The Clerk was directed to obtain the recent report by the Federation of Small Businesses on 'Lifting the Barriers to Growth in UK Small Businesses.'

Action: Clerk.

Given that the proposals in the Employment Bill had already been the subject of public consultation by DEL, the Committee agreed not to place an advertisement in the local press inviting submissions on the proposed Bill. It was agreed to issue an invite via future press releases for comments to be forwarded for the Committee's attention and also to use the Committee's website.

Action: Clerk.

The Chairman reminded members that the event run by the Association of University Teachers in the Long Gallery would follow today's Committee meeting.

    1. Date, Time and Place of Next Meeting

On Tuesday 11 June 2002 at 12 noon in Room 135 Parliament Buildings, to discuss DEL's proposal to merge the Northern Ireland Hotel and Catering College with the University of Ulster. The Minister for Employment and Learning was to attend, accompanied by officials.

The Chairman adjourned the meeting at 3.20pm.

Dr Esmond Birnie MLA
Chairman, Committee for Employment and Learning

13 June 2002